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|I spent a long time today discussing autopilots with my avionics shop. He told me that he vastly prefers the GFC600 over the STEC. He also said that it was a piece of cake to install and maintain. The servos are all interchangeable (not the case with the STEC) which makes troubleshooting easy. He said its performance in the planes they have done an install in is nothing short of spectacular. He said that he has done a complete install for $22,500 including the autopilot. He has one P210 customer already waiting for the STC - which Garmin indicates is within a year. The other interesting thing he said is that when STEC gets an STC it is often very specific to specific equipment and they will create multiple STCs for a single aircraft equipped differently. As such they will get a STC for the P210 with the piston engine and a different STC for the Silver Eagle. He said Garmin takes a different approach and when they STC an airframe almost all aircraft are covered regardless of year and equipment - so the P210 STC will cover all models including Silver Eagles. |
The more interesting information is that Garmin told him that 15 orders gets an airframe moved to the front of the priority list for STC. I want to do either the GFC600 or the STEC3100. My preference is the Garmin but I had believed the STC would be a long wait. With this new information I wanted to poll and see how many of us are interested in the Garmin unit. If our demand plus the piston fleet can be aggregated maybe we can make it happen quickly. James at General Avionics is willing to help identify piston P210s and communicate the Silver Eagle demand to Garmin also.
|Jim....Bob here at PropJet...I think that you might have part of this wrong...the Garmin auto pilot is a complete install, new servos new system complete...it is my understanding that with the S-TEC unit, you only have to change the computer and the servos (S-Tec) that are in the plane work with the new 3100 digital unit...if this is the case, seems that most SE owners would opt for the computer change out as opposed to a complete install....I'll research it some more, but I'm building a custom SE at this time for a client and he wants the latest and the greatest. Garmin like you mentioned wants 10 to 15 promises (which I could have given them) except that now with this Garmin entry and no promises, plus utilizing the existing servos seems like S-Tec will win out...just my thoughts, let me know.|
|Bob - what I was told was that the 3100 is around 12k. The GFC600 is 19,995. The GFC involves more in terms of the servis but is not difficult or expensive. James felt that the additional cost is justified given what he feels is better performance and easier serviceability going forward. You get tighter integration with the G600 and the GTN750s. You also get envelope protection at all times in the background. Both are good upgrades from the 55x but if I can get it done soon and within a 10 a 15k price differential I would rather have Garmin. I have real concerns about long term health of Genesys.|
|If all of the SE owners would agree, I'm with you in regarding the Garmin A/P...another item that no one is looking at, is that the Garmin servos are better, they are brushless motors on the servos and will not require the constant start up voltage adjustments required...this would be the major diff as opposed to just installing the S-Tec computer. I don't know if S-Tec will have the new improved servos that Garmin has. I'm not sure about the cost of installation, as per new bracket and mounting, with possible new wiring....but the outcome will be amazing like you mentioned...I'm not aware of exactly what the S-Tec will be priced at and what you get for the price...I did here from a few Avionics shops in my area that perhaps the complete install package might be somewhere around $25K.....|
|I am not trying to advocate over one versus the other. I think they are both good options. I have a preference and simply want to make sure we get credit with Garmin for the interest that exists. If Garmin is not going to work out I am fully prepared to work as hard as possible to get something done with Genesys. Communication is in everyone's best interest. My data may also be imperfect but I really want this board to turn into a free flow of best available info between owners. I am happy to be corrected if I am hearing something wrong. |
|Hi Guys, I sent in October already a request to Garmin that we have around 10 owners ready to buy the GFC600 if a fast STC would be available....no reaction for the moment... |
I had also a long talk with my shop about this option. For shure...the Garmin with the better servos is the better combination. I was a little bit reluctant about the costs. My shop told me that it would have to redo the complete wiring and new brackets...the bill just for the installation (without the cost of the autopilot) was around 20k. My shop predicted more something around 40k+
On the other hand the 3100 is a real plug and play...
|Well as someone who has a perfectly functional STEC55X, an upgrade to digital might make sense if it was a straight computer swap-out for a 3100 and around $10-12k. No way would I regard a full transplant for a GFC600 to be a cost-effective upgrade at $40k. If that were the only one on offer, I would stay as I am. |
Just my 2c worth.
|This is why, I kind of think that the S-Tec will more then likely win out over the Garmin A/P.....way cheaper with the plug and play (minor install) vrs the complete install....I was told that the complete package from Garmin (everything you need) would be about $24K and then the labor would be on top of that, of which I'm sure will be quite expensive....on a new conversion the new system would be a no brainer...|
Location: KCCO & Wunstorf, Germany
|I know I get late to this topic, but I had in mind to upgrade my KFC200 with the upcomming KFC230 ... but due to some bad experience with KFC200 repairs due to limited parts availability from former King OEM I now would prefer a "fresh" install non-King autopilot including all wires/harness, switches, servos, etc... Now the STEC3100 is already certified for the P210N (according to the STEC website), but on the Garmin website they even do not mention the P210N at all... it was therefore very interesting for me to read here, that already about one year ago it was discussed with Garmin and that they stated something about beginning of 2019... For fresh installs (not upgrading from older King/Stec to newer King/Stec autopilots) the price tag is about the same ($20k hardware only). Has anybody new infos on the progress of GFC600&P210N??? I also believe in the greater integration within Garmin, so I would also prefer the GFC600 over the 3100, but I understand that if you can upgrade from an older Stec and the servbos still work good, why not saving $10k! |
As can be seen in the link above, Garmin does not have the p210 slated for the next 12 months..
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